One new question I was posted with this time was on fish being vegetarian. I find it strange that many people consider fish a likely candidate for a vegetarian diet. Later I learned it may be because a vegetarian is often defined as one who doesn't eat meat. Fish is usually not classified under the meat category. No wonder. Perhaps they should include fish, after all, eating fish = eating fish meat. Another misconception about the kinds of food vegetarians can eat is chicken. Some people call themselves pollo-vegetarians - vegetarians who eat chicken. This is nonsense. Chicken isn't vegetarian, it's meat(unless it's mock chicken). Anyway, back to the story, after knowing my answer to the question, both my collegue and her collegue agreeded they cannot be vegetarians because they can't give up fish. I was stumped, I wished I had thought of this sentence: "Then give up everything else except fish"... I guess that will be for next time.
47 comments:
I find it interesting that people always want to challenge why you are vegetarian. For me the reason I am vegetarian is that I have never liked meat or seafood. I figure just like some people dont like brussel sprouts, I have never liked any type of meat the taste , smell and texture are respulsive. When people ask about my ethical beliefs, I know that the conversation will go on for ages. So I just tell people I have never liked any type of meat and the thought of it chewing meat is disgusting to me. It's funny because when I respond this way people just go onto the next topic, but if I respond on ethical choices people want to debate you on it.
Not only fish, seafood too! I don't really like fish because of the smell, unless the deep-fried ones but i was ok with crab and prawn before i turned vegetarian.
It depends on my mood when people ask me why i go vegetarian. If i find that the time, place and people not that right. Or with strangers. I would gives a very simple answer - Not because of religion and not because health. I don't really like meat from young. Perfect, no further question.
MIL - i told her i am doing it for my next generation, hubby. Merit etc, then she would not go further :p
If i have the time or in the mood or in the right environment, then i will reveal more.
Lately, i found that people don't ask me why, if i told them i am a vegetarian. We can talk about food and they (non-veg) even tell me how to cook non-veg dish without using meat. :) Surprise.
Tell you a secret :) When i wanted to turn vegetarian, the tot of ignoring meat except seafood did come to my mind. The book that i read that turned me into vegetarian is more on animals slaughtering. And i had the concept the dying process of seafood is of less sufferring compare to animals.
Anyways, someone knocked some sense into my brain. So all those lovely seafood do not have to be killed because of me. -- crystal
I went to visit fish farm. I find that even i am there i can't feel the sufferring of the fishes in the fish farm. I am not sure how many who went for fish liberation can feel that.
If you observed the way fishes/crabs been released, very few exactly care about the fishes conditions at all.
I hope that the process can be shorten and done real fast, to reduce the the discomfort or hurt to a great extend. But seeing fishes being transfer here and there, it is a long 'suffering' process before they can get their freedom or to their dead journey. One by one, they were been scoop up by different person and throw into the sea, sometime so hard.
I am so worry they will be hurt and how can these fishes or crabs survive in the sea where they now have to look for their own food or escape from been eaten by other sea creatures. Or are we dumping dead or almost dying fishes into the sea.
And after the process, everyone left happily with big smile and hmmm... i start to wonder are we doing for fishes or for our own desire ...
--crystal
This is an acute issue for me, since I've been completely vegan only since last summer. A book I read recently, "Vegan Freak: Being Vegan in a Non-Vegan World", was very helpful for me, since it gave tips on how to handle discussions like these.
Most of the advice in the book is probably familiar for experienced vegans, but I learned a lot from it. For example, not to talk about animal rights before or during a meal with meat-eaters, but only after it!
So true ^_^
Clearly this misconception between being vegetarian and eating whether fish or chicken is very common.
In Europe, it's especially the case regarding fish and shellfish (mussel, oyster, ...).
By the way, I still can get how you can related a plant and a mollusc o_O
For many people, vegetarian means "not eating red meat" or "not eating meat but fish"... and I'm not speaking about explaining also to exclude dairies and eggs.
Dairies, eggs and refined sugar are a the very center of almost any recipe in french cuisine especially when talking about desserts. Talking bout cooking without the ingredients is seen like a provocation ;-)
...we're far from a plant based diet or pure vegetarianism =_=
So I try to say what I eat first, while trying to show how wide and inspirational an entirely plant based diet could be.
Great post!
In India, vegetarians don't consume meat, chicken and fish. Some vegetarians don't even consume eggs. However, almost all the vegetarians are lactovegetarians.
Anonymous1 you are so right! If only my reason is yours, that will save me from all these conversations :)
I hate fish when I was young too Crystal, it was always the last thing I will finish on my plate when given that. An interesting point you made about the releasing of lives.. perhaps you can suggest lowering the bucket into the water for the fishes to swim out next time, that won't put them in so much distress?
heikki: That's so true about the talk to omnis b4 and during a meal. HAven't read vegan freak yet, but it sounds like a good bk.
kristof: Mollusc is more difficult, they usually have no eyes, but I can't stand eating something slimy even b4 I went veg, it juz kind of disgusts me >.<
Hi Kumuda, I love indian food! but i haven't had indian food of ages because of the dairy, I wish there were more non-dairy substitutes.
Yeah, my stock answer is "animal rights" or in Chinese "保护动物". This kind of short answers enable those who don't actually look for a debate to bail out and just say "I see" and move on to another topic.
I don't really like it when people eat various sorts of animal products and still call themselves vegetarian as it makes the word meaningless. At least "vegan" still has a meaning.
I am not a vegetarian, but i came on this forum because recently a few of my frinds became vegetarian and still think its OK to eat fish! I explained to them thats its not right, fish is still meat and a living creature no matter what anyone says. I don't like any meat apart from chicken....but i dont go round saying im a vegetarian just because i only eat one kind of meat i can't get enough of chicken i love it! so it is settled if you eat fish you are NOT a vegetarian sooo get over it! Another thing also if your a vegetarian thats fine no problem.....but don't have a go at people who choose to eat meat it's ridiculous
Thankyou and goodbye
Put it this way:
"I'm vegetarian and I don't eat any meat except fish"
"I'm vegetarian and I don't eat any meat except chicken"
"I'm smart and I don't eat shit except bull shit"
Agree?
im one of those people who eat chicken and not any other kind of meat. my reason for not eating red meat though, is because i dont like the taste of it. So when I go to someone's house for dinner and they don't know me, i just explain it by saying "Im a vegetarian" because its the easiest way to say it without hurting someones feelings or confusing them by saying well.. i eat shrimp and chicken and fish.. but i dont eat this and this and this. I kind of wish there was a name for someone who just ate poultry and not actual red meat.
If you are a vegan most of the time, but then eat a small amount of fish, egg, or dairy products once a month or once every two months, then what is the the correct label for you? Semi-vegetarian? Semi-vegan? Sometimes vegan?
This is how I eat. I wish I could be vegan ALL the time, but I end up with some physical problems if I do, like weakness, problems with my teeth and nails, other problems too...anyone else?
I am 14 and i chose to become a vegetarian when i was 8. My mum told me that fish don't count but i think she is saying that so that i get enough nutrition. I chose to become one because I love animals and i hate that people make them suffer! Fish don't really suffer, they are in water, they are happy.
I recently became a vegetarian. but like most people have said in here people who eat fish or dairy don't count.. I don't think that's true even though fish is still an animal, but it has so many nutrients and honestly they only have a memory span of 2 seconds ( I think it depends on the fish really) but would you still call me a vegetarian if I only ate octopus and some dairy products?
Personally I don't eat meat except for fish and I do refer to myself as a vegetarian because to be honest it's easier than saying I eat fish but no other meat. And also because I don't care what the hardcore veggies think I am doing this for me not for other people. I care about the fate of animals just not fish as I don't give them much thought and I think it would be too hard to stop eating them as I wasn't lucky enough to dislike meat in the first place in fact I love the taste of meat and kind of miss it. But I wont ever eat it again due to my feelings for animals.
Listen to yourselves.
"I care about the fate of animals just not fish as I don't give them much thought"
And if you decided you cared you would find that they are sentient beings who experience life and pain and that eating the dead flesh of a fish is just as bad as eating the dead flesh of a cow or a chicken. What makes red meat so special? Face it, the animals we raise for food are treated cruelly and inhumanely. All animals. Fish are animals.
"Fish don't really suffer, they are in water, they are happy."
Your mother is messing with you. You need to make your own informed decisions. Research the fish farming industry. I can assure you the fish are not happy.
I think people should be able to call themselves whatever they want. Whether or not someone who calls themselves a vegetarian has completely eliminated meat from their diet is trivial. If an individual has taken the step of cutting out some meat from their diet, that person should be applauded. This individual has taken a step towards a healthier and more compassionate lifestyle and to criticize this individual because they are using the title "vegetarian" when by definition they are not a vegetarian is petty. I get the impression from some of the comments on this post that being a vegetarian is more about getting to be called a legitimate vegetarian than about the act of reducing meat consumption and promoting compassion for animals. I am a pescetarian. I do not agree that eating fish is as unethical as eating beef and pork, but that is my own personal belief. My decision to become pescetarian is also largely based on health concerns. Perhaps in the future, as I become more comfortable with the idea of eliminating fish from my diet, I will choose to eliminate meat entirely. Except for fish, I do not eat any animal products. If someone asked I would tell them "I do not eat any meat or animal products except for fish." God forbid I ruffle anyone's feathers by saying "I'm a vegetarian/vegan that eats fish" (even though the defintion of pescetarian as written in Mirriam-Webster's Collegiate Dictionary is "a vegetarian whose diet includes fish" ) because apparently for some people it is all about what you get to call yourself and who deserves what label and other such childishness. I find it appalling that those of us that eliminate a great deal of animal products from our diet but choose to continue to eat fish come under fire from PETA (I'm referring to the PETA image in the post). I eat animal products twice a week when most people eat meat in every meal. Of course, PETA is an organization that would have it that no one owns pets, that progress towards finding a cure for diseases such as AIDS be delayed as a result of halting animal research, and that my grandfather not have his insulin for his diabetes, so to judge oneself through PETA's eyes is probably not the most logical thing to do, anyway. Ultimately, everyone should be free to make their own choices. The most harmful thing to do in trying to get people to reduce the consumption of animal products in their diet is to tell people that the way they live is wrong. It is offensive and no one likes someone telling them that they are more ethical than they are. I believe anyone that lives a compassionate lifestyle should lead by example, rather than trying to say things to people that make them feel bad about themselves.
I definitely agree with the last post! Trying to explain myself to people is a complete pain when I don't eat red meat, chicken, pork, eggs, milk, butter, cheese... and the list goes on, but I still eat seafood on occasion. Not including the occasions where I eat out in which certain dairy products are involved in the prep which isn't a huge deal b/c I don't have food allergies.
There is no perfect person who can perfectly do anything, including vegetarianism/veganism. What I eat or do not eat and what label I use to refer to myself is my business. I try to be conscious of what I eat and where it came from, but I'm not perfect, and anyone who thinks they are 100% of anything is full of it!
Just do you and lightening up on the judgmental when it comes to what others eat and do not eat may open up a lot of possibilities for healthy discussion rather than being "that crazy activist" that people avoid and no one takes seriously!
my understanding is that vegetarians sometimes eat fish or seafood, but then are called PESCAtarians. if you don't... you're a vegetarian.
i don't eat meat (as in chicken, beef, pork, etc) but i do eat seafood. however, it's not really an ethical reason, its more for health reasons... i think people forget about that. not all vegetarians or pescatarians or whatever the hell our label is do it because they want to save the animals, so to speak. not knocking the people that DO want to save the animals though, because that's awesome!
It might be easier to tell people that the reason you don't eat meat is that you just don't like the taste, but that isn't really fair to your own cause. If ethics and animal abuse, or the environment is part of the reason that you don't eat meat then isn't it our duty as somewhat enlightened on these issues to tell others that ask us about it? Just plant the seed in their mind; they might think about it later. Some people really aren't aware of the horrible abuse of factory farming and even if your conversation causes them to eat meat once less a week--that is an accomplishment.
Personally, I'm a vegan, and I STILL get the "Do you eat fish?" comment. Like REALLY PEOPLE! No freaking animal products at ALL I just said and you're STILL asking me!?
I'mma tote this around with me from now on: http://www.secretsocietyofvegans.co.uk/world2/images/stories/tumblr_kthged98z01qz57ez.jpg
First off, thats ridiculous. Cuz if you knew much about food, you would know that you can't classify fish and chicken as eat. There is no such thing as "fish meat". Thats like how you say people calling themseves pollo-vegitarians are silly. Its the same thing. Chicken is also not meat, its poultry (which has its own category seperate from meat). I just found that part slightly offensive because my parents won't allow me to become a full vegitarian because they believe it is unhealthy, so i have to eat chicken. Until I'm 18. I still classify myself as a vegitarian though, because I donteat any form of red meat. Just sayin
Yeah, this is kind of a lame argument. It reminds me of the "bisexuals aren't really gay," argument in the queer community. Get over yourselves.
I have never eaten red meat before. Like, ever. Never had a hamburger, never had a filet mignon, no bacon with breakfast. My parents were both vegetarians when I grew up, and since I wanted to be just like them, I never ate it. Although I did grow up eating chicken and fish and turkey, and my dad has since become a meat eater and my mom is now like me, only eating white meat.
What bothers me is when people get pissed off when I call myself a vegetarian. Frankly, I only really do it in restaurants when the menu is primarily red meat and nothing appeals, I'll often ask the waiter for vegetarian options.
I also don't get why anyone cares. "You mean you feel bad about eating a cow but not a chicken?" Yeah, so what? I'm a hypocrite. What's it to you--You eat cows AND chickens!
Also, red meat is not very good for you, is heavy in your stomach and takes a long time to digest, and you can get a less fatty serving of protein from white meat and/or nuts and beans.
Piscatorian :)
I guess I am a pesca-pollotarian. I don't eat mammals. It is a legitimate classification. A semi-vegetarian is as well, it's just a loose term. The prefix "semi" is widely used in the english language as a descriptive term, as well as "tarian". Pesca and pollo are spanish for fish and chicken. So why do vegetarians have such a problem with these terms? I think it's an issue of pride with vegetarians. That's okay with me if you just don't harass they way other people choose as their diet and what they eat. It sounds so political sometimes when I read comments by extremist vegetarians. Get over yourself, it doesn't matter what kind of "tarian" you are, we are all have seperate beliefs so respect that just like you respect and accept opinions other than your own. If you don't then you are going to have a hard time getting along in this world today!
What do you call someone who doesn't consume dairy or beef, but occasionally has fish or chicken? What do you call them if they eat only organic?
Meat is defined as "The flesh of an animal as food."
Fish is an animal. So it is also meat if the above definition is followed.
It's not a matter of pride. But the fact that if a person eats seafood and chicken, he/she is not a vegetarian.
If you call yourself a "vegetarian" despite that, it confuses people, and the real vegetarians end up having asked questions such as "Do you eat fish" when they tell people they are veg. Although we are fine with these questions, it is bad for us when it comes to eating out, we can order "vegetarian" dishes and get served fish or chicken.
If you eat seafood and chicken, the simple way is to just tell people you eat only certain kinds of meat. There's no need to have a term for that.
Yup, it's much easier to say that I'm a veggie, though I sometimes it sushi for the protein, and the taste. I agree, people are always challenging me about me not being vegetarian enough. Both from carnivores and vegies!
Since giving up meat I no longer have animal-corpse-gas-flavored burps.
If you're a vegetarian or any kind of variation and you're doing it for ethical reasons,you're doing it wrong. Go vegan,stay vegan. For yourself,for the animals,and for the earth(and future generations of all creatures that inhabit this planet).The right path is not the easiest,but when its something you believe in,its easy.
I've worked very hard at becoming a Veggie, and have been one for almost five years now. I do not do this for the 'it' factor, rather I believe my body and soul benefit from not eating a land dwelling creature. I do however eat the occasional bit of fish if there is nothing suitable on the menu in a restaurant. I strive to be an ethical loving human, and am a Reiki practitioner to boot. I feel that when people start getting snobby and splitting hairs about exactly what makes a vegetarian, it becomes a matter of ego, the 'I'm better than you' mentality, which has no place in the world of Vegetarianism. You can eat meat, fish, poultry whatever and still be a loving caring person...it's not wrong when you've been raised that way, when it's all you know, some people just don't have the time, and or energy to completely overhaul their way of life. I mean when did we become so sad that we have to sit around and point sticks at our fellow humans for what they are or are not eating? Plants have a consciousness too btw, maybe not one that we can consciously communicate with, but they do respond to anger, and negative energy, and to love. So does water.
With that in mind, are people supposed to starve themselves and live on air alone?
I say you do what feels right for you, make no excuses to others, and mind your own business when it comes to your beliefs about what people should and should not eat. Again, I will say this, I am a proud Veggie, and I don't think it's wrong for me to literally once in a blue moon eat fish, that doesn't make me any less or more than someone who just survives on Plant life alone. If you have the discipline to do that, than kudos to you, but don't diss me for having fish a few times a year.
In Asia, our version "vegetarian" would mean no fish, most people do not mix that up unless they have not associated with vegetarians before. Maybe that is not the case in the West.
really lively discussion going on and very interesting views from all.
just thought i'd share my own experience on the "fish" topic.
i once had lunch with a friend's friend, who is a vegetarian at home becoz her family is vegetarian (i think her being a veg was not by her own choice). first off, she arrived late and did not want to order food but wanted to eat the omnivore leftovers of my friends. i was taken aback coz i had heard she is a vegetarian... but that was not the end of it, she passed over the fish dish and ate the ikan bilis one, all the while explaining between mouthfuls that she don't eat big fish, ikan bilis becoz they are small fish is fine. I was absolutely flabbergasted at this point. if in absolute numbers, a fish is 1 life and a plate of ikan bilis is 40-50 lives. there is some warped logic in her veg beliefs... plus that sort of scourge-like pick freebies attitude is just sad. it is vegetarians like her that give vegetarianism a bad name...
Goodafternnooon evvverybody first off being vegan u can atleast save 100 lifes a year:-).Its not that hard to be vegan now in days theres an entire vegan market out there just goto peta2.com or compassion over killing or vegan outreach..and many more,i gave up meat 3 years ago in one day,iam boycotting all suffering industries..factory farming(poultry,fish,dairy,meat)its a way of life..from the make up i wear to the clothes i put on,everyones entitiled to there own lifestlye tho but honestly to those who put the"-erian"youre honestly confusing people that dont kno much bout it,please let them kno y u consider youreself whatever "-erian",or dont say nothing at all...most of the people ive meet eat animals and i have to explain that. To them and im feed up trying to explain the reasons y people use the term even tho they eat animals and fish do suffer alot!but its everyones own choice to do what they want in life.vegans get proteins shakes and vitamins!google them!theres also cruelty free make up such as lime crime and lingerie such as purrfect pineapples..hemp socks and soo much out there to change completely youre life-style!i thank all those soo called extremest spreading the word to all humans about the murder,suffering and horrible diets,to the Alf and Elf for doing direct action and to all the vegans and humans that are changing this world!For those who are trying to stop consuming any sort of meat Thank you for reducing our emmisions in this planet and the suffering of certain animals...all of us humans can do so much more!When is it enough?!for us to realize were killing our world
" Never stop questioning,The animals need an army to fight for them"(Gather)
-peacelove and equality for all
If fish and chicken were vegetables, I would have been vegetarian all my life. Go find another term, dont call yourselves vegetarian. How about animaltarian. I eat no meat now, I am vegetarian. I dont want to order a vegetarian dish with chicken or fish in it.
I feel u bc wat they fell to realize eating a egg is not like u eating a baby chick it take a rooster for it to even b a chick and its not harming a animal
Clearly there are two major reasons for a vegetarian lifestyle:
1) to save animals, stop killing animals for food
2) for health reasons, better quality of live and longevity
I personally care more about 2 than 1, not that I don’t care about animals, I’m a realist. I see human health to be the primary focus of my efforts toward a more vegetable based diet.
I see over weight vegetarians and wondered how can that be while eating such a good diet. Well then one day I saw someone I know, that owns a vegetarian restaurant coming out of Krispy Kreme donuts with a box of donuts. Sure enough, no meat products in these little gems. A lot of junk food can be classified as vegetarian.
I do not take vitamins; I get all of my vitamins from the food I eat and the sun. I eat milk, eggs, fish and occasionally poultry, all in relatively small quantities to provide my body with B12 and carnosine. I avoid refined sugars and processed foods because they are not compatible with human health. My focus is beans, greens, grains, nuts, seeds and a whole lot of fruit and veggies.
My biggest problem with the strict vegetarian diet is the absence of vitamin B12. B12 is essential for human health; a diet that does not contain enough B12 from the food you eat to survive is NOT a human diet.
Sorry but fortified foods and vitamin supplements don’t count. This is all man-made and does not occur on nature.
I’m not against the vegetarian (animal) cause; I just don’t think it has a clear focus on human health.
still learning: I believe your friend may have been forced into vegetarianism by her family tradition and it is not out of her own free will.
anonymous: I do not disagree that on a vegan diet you need B12 supplements or fortified foods.
The issue is not so much with a vegan diet, but with the way of production of food now in our world, whcih does not allow sufficient B12 in the diet anymore - at most minute quantities not sufficient for the human body.
The way of food production has made many things unnatural and not only vegetarians but also non-vegetarians are getting supplements because of deficiencies in their diet. Matched with living in a fast paced world where you need all the energy you can get to keep functioning, it is not rare to see all kinds of people taking supplements, not only vegetarians.
I take a B12 supplement myself, but I do not think the vegan diet is unnatural, considering many non-vegetarians are also taking supplements to help them cope with the current demands of society.
HI,
not a Vegan or Vegetarian, but I am pretty sure most of you are incorrect... Pescetarian is the word you are looking for, means the only meat you eat is from the sea. Steve Jobs was a Pescetarian. Being a vegetarian & vegan are different. Vegetarian eat no meat, but do eat eggs, milk & cheese. Vegan eat or wear NO ANIMAL BY products at all. I love animals & have researched this. But i have issues with most. Animals will always consume animals for meat, My dog will always have animal by products in her food because she is a carnivore & most of all without the skins, bones & proteins of animals the human race would not be here. I do think many animals are not meant to be eaten ( horse, dog, cat... many more ( maybe will become a Pescetarian one day. Good luck to all
HI,
not a Vegan or Vegetarian, but I am pretty sure most of you are incorrect... Pescetarian is the word you are looking for, means the only meat you eat is from the sea. Steve Jobs was a Pescetarian. Being a vegetarian & vegan are different. Vegetarian eat no meat, but do eat eggs, milk & cheese. Vegan eat or wear NO ANIMAL BY products at all. I love animals & have researched this. But i have issues with most. Animals will always consume animals for meat, My dog will always have animal by products in her food because she is a carnivore & most of all without the skins, bones & proteins of animals the human race would not be here. I do think many animals are not meant to be eaten ( horse, dog, cat... many more ( maybe will become a Pescetarian one day. Good luck to all
I don't find a single thing wrong with eating an animal. I love animals I just choose not to eat most of them. I'll eat chicken but only the breast cuz its the only part I like. I'll never stop eating seafood either but I don't claim to be a vegetarian. All you fools wanna call yourselves real vegetarians, Stop eating meat period.
I am not a vegetarian, nor am I vegan, although ethically I wish I was. Despite my being a meat( flesh of Any animals) eater, I am offended for true vegetarians/vegans by the severely overweight woman who comes into my job who eats poultry and fish/seafood Everyday and still calls herself a vegetarian. Give me a break lady! Anyone agree?
So I will go sometimes weeks on a vegetarian diet and have chicken occaissionally. I do not call myself a vegetarian. I dont call myself anything and think getting hung up on labels is kind of stupid. I like the idea of being vegan and often go days eating a vegan diet but I dont get militant about it with other people and I dont beat myself up when I do eat chicken. someone posted "whats so special about red meat?" Well to me red meat IS more important than birds and fish. They are mammals and so are we. They function at a much higher level of intellect than fish or chickens. Also red meat is not healthy whereas fish and chicken are. I dont eat fish because I hate it. I have been so turned off by some vegans who are so judgemental and I will tell you that you do harm to animals with that attitude. People need education not condemnation right off the bat. You do nothing but turn people away that might actually at least TRY TO eat less meat if you talked to them with respect. I have finally convinced several friends to at least go meatless a few days a week. If you think that does not make a difference imagine what it would do for the animals if the whole world went meatless 2 days a week? Stop the arrogance and feeling superior and actually try to attract people to the idea of helping animals instead of turning them away with an arrogant, Im better than you attitude.
https://www.vegsoc.org/fish#
The article is wrong about fish and chicken they are not meat but both poultry, and therefore are supported until the vegetarian diet umbrella, even if you don't like it.
Like other comments said it's very judgmental.
If you are all high and mighty then way aren't you vegans?
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